President Obama’s proposal to Republicans to avoid going over the so-called fiscal cliff — huge tax increases, huge spending increases, and no serious entitlement reform — is risible. What the president is offering up is essentially his last budget, which didn’t win a single vote of support from any member of Congress.
It may be that this proposal was simply an extreme negotiating position that will be dramatically reshaped over the next 27 days. Or it may be that the president is, for political reasons, happy to have us go over the cliff. The calculation would be that he’s confident he can pin blame on Republicans for this having happened, portraying them as willing to increase taxes on the middle class and wreck the economy in order to keep taxes on the richest 1 percent from going up to Clinton-era rates.
The president, fresh off his re-election victory, does have a strong hand to play. But I agree with those (like Keith Hennessey and Charles Krauthammer) who believe Mr. Obama may well over-reach and in the process severely injure his second term. Because if we go over the fiscal cliff, and as a result unemployment rises to above 9 percent and we go into another recession, there is no way the president escapes responsibility for that. We saw a version of this during the 44-day debt negotiations in the summer of 2011, an ugly and unsatisfying process that left everyone associated with it — including the president — diminished and damaged (for more, see Bob Woodard’s instructive book, The Price of Politics). If we go over the fiscal cliff, it will make that episode look like a model of good government. The public will be enraged at everyone who played a part in this failure — and the most conspicuous person of all will be Mr. Obama.
His first term was characterized by anemic economic growth and job creation — and if no deal is struck between now and the New Year he may well see to it that his second term is no better. This time, by the way, he won’t be able to blame George W. Bush for his failures. Which is another way of saying that the next few weeks could go some distance toward determining whether Obama’s presidency one day ranks as among the most economically ruinous in American history.
In light of that, Republicans should continue to act in a reasonable and responsible way, as Speaker Boehner has with his offer to raise tax revenues in exchange for spending cuts and some steps toward entitlement reform. It may be that the president comes to his senses, and if so they should be ready to deal. But if not, and if the president insists that the GOP jettison its beliefs and simply accede to Mr. Obama’s liberal wish list, Republicans should — in a respectful but firm way — say no thanks. If they do so, Republicans shouldn’t pretend that going over the cliff won’t hurt them. But they shouldn’t be blind to the fact that it will also hurt Mr. Obama, and perhaps permanently.
Republicans, then, are in a somewhat stronger position than they may think. And even if they weren’t, capitulation — which increasingly is what the president seems to demand of them — would be undignified and unwise. If we go over the fiscal cliff, the country will unfortunately suffer. But so, politically, will Barack Obama, the architect of the pain.
I don't know, Mr. Wehner, I think much of the public – which doesn't follow the green eyeshade details on such matters – still views this as the "Republicans protecting the rich" and everything follows from that. That is, the economy double dips back in recession and taxes on the middle class (including AMT and payroll) increase. All because, so the narrative goes, the GOP won't raise taxes on the rich. n nThat's how the public will see it unless the Republican can shift the debate back away from higher taxes on the top income earners. Right now, that perception is driving this debate.
Republicans would be blamed for the disaster that follows Obama's budget, so it's not like Republicans have anything to gain for capitulating. On the contrary they would lose their reputation for fiscal responsibility.
What reputation for fiscal responsibility?
What reputation for fiscal responsibility?
I agree with stevemg that the Republicans will be blamed for not raising taxes on the wealthy. I think the Republicans should come back with closing loopholes, some entitlement reform and agree to raising taxes on the those making $500,000 as Warren Buffet suggested. That would help the small business owner and middle America. Compromise is needed from both sides.
Most cons still don't get it. Of course, Obama is happy to go over the cliff, provided he can blame Republicans because he, and many other Dems, want all that revenue from taxes going up on everyone. With spending also dropping due to the sequester agreement, he will start 2013 with a better balanced budget picture for the coming decade. Recessionary? Probably, in which case, Obama will produce a new stimulus plan that raises spending in areas where he wants it, cuts some of the newly raised taxes on the "middle class" but not before soaking up a year or two of all that added revenue. So why should he not hold out for no deal short of GOP capitulation? What compromise could possibly be better for him?
Most Libs still don't get it . Obama policies will start a new great depression.
Interesting how 4 years of his policies already haven't led to that.
Americans do not like bullies. Obama sure sounds like one now. They voted in a Republican house in 2010 precisely because they felt bullied by Obama. They sypathized with Clinton during the Lewinsky affair for the same reason. If Republicans agree to the meaningless tax burden on the "rich" contingent on simultaneous package of real reductions of at least two to three times higher, Obama will not accept the deal and the public will punish the Democrats. He is impervious to being punished. Don't ask me how.
A month ago, Mr. Wehner, I would have agreed with you. Today, not so much. Obama may take us over the cliff, all the bad things you list will follow, and… nAnd the Republicans will get the blame. Our fellow Americans just reelected this doofus. Why should we think they'll suddenly see the light when he continues to wreck the country?
Does Obama want to avoid the Fiscal Cliff? He gets so many things he wants: n. Tax increases on EVERYONE n. Massive cuts in Defense spending n . Another recession? Why a recession makes MORE people dependent on the government. nThe end goal is a fiscal problem so great that the only solution is a Value Added Tax. A VAT is heroine for a huge, controlling government. And power to the Governing Elite.
"…Republicans should continue to act in a reasonable and responsible way, …" unfortunately there is no payoff in acting in a reasonable and responsible way. If there was, Romney would've won in a landslide. nRepublicans should offer the idiot Obama voters what they want – a free cell phone and contraceptive pill in every pot paid for by "the Rich", then sit back and enjoy the retirement; it's going to be a short one.
Wish he would have won in a landslide. I am still too depressed for words.
Yes and no. n nWe do need some pain right now. We won't get our country back unless we sacrifice. n nEven when Obama takes us over the cliff, only We The People will suffer. The WH, the Congress will not…. n
Anyway. Obama wants us over the cliff and so do I. nWhat the heck can we do anyway.. We know Boehner will cave, he always does. n nWe need GOPs with G U T S…
Obama has already given us 4 years of PAIN. 4 years of division, 4 years of DEBT, and 4 years of the worst UNEMPLOYMENT since the Great Depression. But he has given us lots of welfare payments, Foodstamps, and extended UNEMPLOYMENT benefits. Not exactly the American Dream, but then Obama did promise to transform our nation. UNEMPLOYMENT is already headed back to 9% without the Fiscal Cliff. Obama rigged the numbers before the election, and spent like crazy in the 3rd Qtr, and created hundreds of billions in funny money to get him through the election. That can't and won't continue, which means we are all about to pay. Our only hope was to elect someone who knew the economy and knew business, but 50.8% of the American people chose failure, incompetenence, UNEMPLOYMENT, DEBT, and foodstamps. So they shouldn't be surprise when they get even more of it!
That huge fiscal crises beginning in 2008 keeps on paying dividends. Yes Bush is to blame. Yes the public still blames him. And they are right. Just look at where Europe is. Count your blessings guy. We could have seen Fortune 50 corporations unable to meet payroll. Yep that bad. Instead of a Bush legacy of the Great Recession it could have been the Great Depression 2.
Greeks had it years ago: if people can vote themselves benefits, they likely will, to the point that the democratic state collapses. Which is what we face.r nItu2019s not the deficit or the debt or even the fiscal cliff. All of those help keep the economy down and unemployment up, but the nation can get by, for now.r nr nThe problems are two:r nr n1.tOur promises to ourselves (entitlements) and to others (protection, paying our bills) ought to be kept or only God could know what might happen, but ALL can be sure that it would be awful, maybe 1861, 1929, and 1941 all at once, THAT bad!r nr n2.tWe had growth due to rising population, improving education, innovation, entrepreneurship, infrastructure, investments, and a relatively orderly world, both at home and abroad, from 1945 until recent years. We have none of this now, due to fiscal issues, strategic and international competitive changes, lifestyles, immigration changes, institutional failures in health, in education, in government, and in big business bordering on corruption, refusals to invest or to reward investment, and a great proliferation in the opportunity to not only complain or to bargain but to obstruct.r nr nIF going over the cliff might get our attention, then I am all for it.
"portraying them as willing to increase taxes on the middle class and wreck the economy in order to keep taxes on the richest 1 percent from going up to Clinton-era rates." n nDemocrats don't have to do anything to portray Republicans this way, their own actions or lack of actions already prove it.
President Obama, Architect of Failure.
The media will close ranks and protect Obama no matter what. So yes, if we go off the cliff, it will be that the Republicans "refused to negotiate" or "compromise" and they wanted to "protect the rich." I agree with the pundits who have said the Republicans should go the Democrats one better and propose a 50% across the board tax on the rich, that's anyone making over $250k. When they don't get it they can then kick and scream and say Obama protected the rich and refused their proposal. If they do get it, they can then take the heat from "the rich" and say "See, the rich hate us now, we are not the party of the rich."
A compromise for both. Carve out the business income reported on individual tax returns and extend the tax rate on this income along with under 250k. Republicans saves the job creators from tax increases and Obama gets to tax the coupon-clipping rich. The facade will be exposed that the real tax revenue was coming from the small business job creators.
How does going over the cliff hurt Obama permanently? He can't run for office again? He cannot pass anything thru Congress? He cannot get his nominees past filibusters? People will call him hitler and worse? Actaully all these things are already happening to him, so I think nothing that happens can really hurt him. He should go over the cliff with gusto.
Obama has more teflon on him than Clinton did. Nothing sticks, nor will it ever. n nThe deluded people who voted for him are still enamored and still deluded. n nThe Republicans look paralyzed and hold little power. If they cave they'll be blamed, if they don't cave they'll be blamed. A lose, lose situation. n nThe MSM is pathetic and treacherous and cannot be trusted a whit. n nThe whole scenario is disgusting and discouraging. n nAnd yes, Obama has caused more pain than I can remember in 6 decades.
I think Obama wants to go over the fiscal cliff in order to raise taxes on the middle class without taking the blame. That's why his demands are increasingly unreasonable. I think the best way to handle this is to bring up the Senate's "Tax the Rich" bill in the House to extend Bush tax rates only for those making less than $250,000 at the last possible minute. Then all Republicans should vote "Present." It would pass on strictly Democratic votes. All the speeches, press releases and interviews should make clear that because Obama is holding the middle class hostage, we allowed this terrible idea to pass. We think it will cause an economic disaster. We don't want to raise tax rates on anybody. However, we are saving as many people as possible, given Obama's unreasonable demands. We blame Obama for the coming recession. Then we take the sequester, so at least we get some solid spending cuts Obama can't weasel out of. This would be a better deal than anything Obama is likely to agree to.
At some poiint we ALL have to call it like it is. Obama is goiung to get what he wants because he will kick and scream until it happens. He will not work with Republicans to get a deal done, instead he goes back on the campain trail to do everything he can to get the present Republicans in the house voted out in 2014. Obama fights below the belt at all times. But until the Republicans take a few shots at his jewels as well, they will continue to lose. I know its not honorable, but the President threw any kind of honor out the door a long time ago. Its time to fight fire with fire. Boehner is NOT the guy to take down Obama. Until we get someone in there with some stones, the Republicans will lose. Remember, Lincoln tried to appoint all the “honorable” generals he could at the beginning of the Civil War, only to get humiliated in defeat. Not until he appointed the “no hold barred”, “bottom of the class” Sherman did the north finally begin to win the war.
In case you've forgotten (you know how that Romnesia is going around) all this was discussed at length during the primaries & the general election campaign. Americans went to the polls, cast their votes, and what do you know. Dick Morris & Karl Rove & Commentary were wrong, President Obama won comfortably, and the Democrats picked up a significant number of seats in the Congress. So suck it up and deal with it, the people have spoken and they are on our side, raise taxes on the rich, don't take away our safety net, focus on putting America back to work before debt & spending. You guys are like a broken record with a big scratch down the middle. n